Comments on: D&C Lesson #2–The Atonement as the Root of Christian Doctrine http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/2009/01/11/dc-lesson-2-the-atonement-as-the-root-of-christian-doctrine/ Perusing, pondering, and pattering about the Book of Mormon Sat, 19 Dec 2009 17:36:38 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: mice152 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/2009/01/11/dc-lesson-2-the-atonement-as-the-root-of-christian-doctrine/#comment-1313 mice152 Sat, 17 Jan 2009 20:10:58 +0000 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/?p=93#comment-1313 I think my favorite verse in this regarding Jesus as advocate is D&C 45:3, "Listen to him who is the advocate with the Father, who is pleading your cause before him." I love the idea of Jesus, now, actively praying on our behalf and pleading with the Father for us. It's a beautiful statement on how the atonement is an ongoing thing and that Jesus is just as concerned for each of us now as He was for Mary, Martha and Lazarus back in the day. I think my favorite verse in this regarding Jesus as advocate is D&C 45:3, “Listen to him who is the advocate with the Father, who is pleading your cause before him.” I love the idea of Jesus, now, actively praying on our behalf and pleading with the Father for us. It’s a beautiful statement on how the atonement is an ongoing thing and that Jesus is just as concerned for each of us now as He was for Mary, Martha and Lazarus back in the day.

]]> By: isaiahsfan http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/2009/01/11/dc-lesson-2-the-atonement-as-the-root-of-christian-doctrine/#comment-1312 isaiahsfan Sat, 17 Jan 2009 06:49:34 +0000 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/?p=93#comment-1312 I confess to getting way to esoteric on atonement theories. You can really freak your mind out on them! But I do realize that the atonement was designed for the simplest mind to understand and grasp hold of. I love studying atonement theory, but when it comes down to it, we don't have to know exactly how it works in order for it to be effective. Since Jesus is our ADVOCATE, he is the one who is drawing us to the Father, toward eternal life, and he will represent our case and do his best to get us there. 3 Ne 27:14-15 And my Father sent me that I might be lifted up upon the cross; and after that I had been lifted up upon the cross, that I might draw all men unto me, that as I have been lifted up by men even so should men be lifted up by the Father, to stand before me, to be judged of their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil— And for this cause have I been lifted up; therefore, according to the power of the Father I will draw all men unto me, that they may be judged according to their works. I confess to getting way to esoteric on atonement theories. You can really freak your mind out on them! But I do realize that the atonement was designed for the simplest mind to understand and grasp hold of. I love studying atonement theory, but when it comes down to it, we don’t have to know exactly how it works in order for it to be effective.

Since Jesus is our ADVOCATE, he is the one who is drawing us to the Father, toward eternal life, and he will represent our case and do his best to get us there.

3 Ne 27:14-15
And my Father sent me that I might be lifted up upon the cross; and after that I had been lifted up upon the cross, that I might draw all men unto me, that as I have been lifted up by men even so should men be lifted up by the Father, to stand before me, to be judged of their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil—
And for this cause have I been lifted up; therefore, according to the power of the Father I will draw all men unto me, that they may be judged according to their works.

]]> By: grammakelly http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/2009/01/11/dc-lesson-2-the-atonement-as-the-root-of-christian-doctrine/#comment-1311 grammakelly Thu, 15 Jan 2009 15:25:45 +0000 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/?p=93#comment-1311 Very well stated! I think that the atonement will be a uniquely personal experience for each one of us. We will all draw on different aspects of the gift offered us in different ways. No matter which if any of the well researched theories above(thanks for your extra mile of research!) we may ascribe to, the power of the atonement in our lives comes down to one thing. Do we accept it or not? If not, sit back and watch your life fly by, but don't expect exualtation in the end. If we do, then the burden to keep the commandments to the best of our ability, seek repentance when necessary, and endure to the end will bring us the greatest of all the blessings of the atonement-ETERNAL LIFE! Very well stated! I think that the atonement will be a uniquely personal experience for each one of us. We will all draw on different aspects of the gift offered us in different ways. No matter which if any of the well researched theories above(thanks for your extra mile of research!) we may ascribe to, the power of the atonement in our lives comes down to one thing. Do we accept it or not? If not, sit back and watch your life fly by, but don’t expect exualtation in the end. If we do, then the burden to keep the commandments to the best of our ability, seek repentance when necessary, and endure to the end will bring us the greatest of all the blessings of the atonement-ETERNAL LIFE!

]]> By: mice152 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/2009/01/11/dc-lesson-2-the-atonement-as-the-root-of-christian-doctrine/#comment-1310 mice152 Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:34:28 +0000 http://bomgroupies.wordpress.com/?p=93#comment-1310 I haven't read through all of the links you posted but reading the different versions, I am impressed at how many of them I think are part and parcel of the atonement. I suppose that's one reason I like the LDS version/understanding so much. In my understanding, Jesus' atonement encompassed everything from the Garden to the cross and in so doing not only makes recompense for my sins (penal substitution theory?) but also makes up for the negative effects of mortality and the effects of my sins upon myself and others (ransom theory?). I'm not wholly certain what the compassion theory is but the atonement is rife with love: love from the Father and the Son for us, the Father's love for the Son and the Son's love for the Father. And I am impressed that in the midst of this, because of the sacrifice and suffering of Jesus, He has great empathy with each of us. We read D&C 122:8 and 88:6, which made me think of Heb 4:15. We have a God who understands everything about mortality, the temptations of sin and the agony not only of physical pain but of spiritual anguish. He has suffered more than I will ever and this compels me to seek Him out as one who understands me and where I am and also to honor Him and reverence Him and try to be like Him (moral theory?). In this, the atonement then binds us to God with love. He has saved us, so we love Him. He understands us and comforts us in our times of need, so we love Him. Specifically from D&C 19, I learn that the atonement is truly unlimited. Jesus tells us that if we do not repent, then we must suffer (v. 4) but that such suffering is not endless in the sense of time but endless in the sense of God's law and its affixed consequences being eternal (v.11-12). My extrapolation of these verses is that all mankind, at some point, is saved by the atonement, even those in the Telestial Kingdom and that the only ones who truly remain untouched by Jesus' sacrifice are those who knowingly and willingly refuse the gift (the sons of Perdition). I haven’t read through all of the links you posted but reading the different versions, I am impressed at how many of them I think are part and parcel of the atonement. I suppose that’s one reason I like the LDS version/understanding so much. In my understanding, Jesus’ atonement encompassed everything from the Garden to the cross and in so doing not only makes recompense for my sins (penal substitution theory?) but also makes up for the negative effects of mortality and the effects of my sins upon myself and others (ransom theory?).

I’m not wholly certain what the compassion theory is but the atonement is rife with love: love from the Father and the Son for us, the Father’s love for the Son and the Son’s love for the Father. And I am impressed that in the midst of this, because of the sacrifice and suffering of Jesus, He has great empathy with each of us. We read D&C 122:8 and 88:6, which made me think of Heb 4:15. We have a God who understands everything about mortality, the temptations of sin and the agony not only of physical pain but of spiritual anguish. He has suffered more than I will ever and this compels me to seek Him out as one who understands me and where I am and also to honor Him and reverence Him and try to be like Him (moral theory?). In this, the atonement then binds us to God with love. He has saved us, so we love Him. He understands us and comforts us in our times of need, so we love Him.

Specifically from D&C 19, I learn that the atonement is truly unlimited. Jesus tells us that if we do not repent, then we must suffer (v. 4) but that such suffering is not endless in the sense of time but endless in the sense of God’s law and its affixed consequences being eternal (v.11-12). My extrapolation of these verses is that all mankind, at some point, is saved by the atonement, even those in the Telestial Kingdom and that the only ones who truly remain untouched by Jesus’ sacrifice are those who knowingly and willingly refuse the gift (the sons of Perdition).

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